Transcript of Ep. 227:
Kim Kardashian West & Allison Statter
on Friendship and their New Beauty Collection
Jessica Matlin: Okay. This is not a drill.
Jennifer G. Sullivan: Everybody, it’s not a drill. We weren’t punking you with the title of this episode. We do indeed have Kim Kardashian West, and Allison Statter on the line. Jess—
Jess: Should we let them in?
Jenn: No, just kidding. We just finished recording it actually. And I’ve never been more nervous for a technical malfunction in my entire life, but it went pretty smoothly. What a lovely duo. So, let me just fill you in on why we’re having them on the show, and who they are in case you are still under that rock. They just launched a collection for KKW, the KKW X Allison. I never know how to say X. It’s a collaboration KKW and Allison makeup collection, all best friend themed. And when we heard that, Jess, I felt like they were us.
Jess: I got the fuzzies. Yeah, I got the fuzzies.
Jenn: Yeah, we’re friends, they’re friends, let’s do this. So, they’ve been best friends since they were toddlers, since they were babies, because their parents were good friends.
Jess: You remember because we were on the line with Kim before Allison popped on. It was suddenly like Kim just popped onto our screen.
Jenn: Two minutes early by the way.
Jess: Exactly. I loved it. Or like-
Jenn: Classy. Classy woman.
Jess: I really liked that. So, she arrived early. And we were talking to her, and I said like, "How long have you guys known each other?" And she told us that Allison came to visit when she was born, like her parents took Allison to the hospital. So, they go way back.
Jenn: Right. They grew up together in Los Angeles. So, Allison Statter, she’s the co-founder of Blended Strategy Group. A celebrity, and influencer marketing, and PR agency. Listen, this woman knows beauty. Some of her company’s clients include Revlon, Jen Atkin, Nudestix, Elizabeth Arden. So, she’s a baller in her own, right. She’s also a mom of three boys. And then there’s Kim Kardashian West. In case you haven’t heard of her, she’s the star of her family’s famous unscripted show, Keeping Up with the Kardashians. She’s also a beauty and fashion entrepreneur. You know her brands, KKW Beauty, KKW Fragrance, and Skims. Like Allison, she’s also a mom of four with her husband, Kanye West. And so, they were joining us independently, all four of us in different locations, as one does during the pandemic. And we had such a fun chat. It was just like catching up with girlfriends. So, I’m so excited for you guys to hear this. You ready?
Jess: I’m ready.
[MUSIC]
Jenn: We did it. We’re all here together. Hi guys. Welcome to Fat Mascara.
Kim Kardashian West: Thanks.
Jess: Welcome.
Kim: Thanks for having us.
Jenn: It’s our pleasure. We filled in our listeners about your collection. And we were just pulling up ... You had sent it to us earlier today, some of the compacts to talk about them. And it’s so clear if you didn’t know this already, that sharing like beauty moments is one of the ways that friends bonds. I don’t want you guys to confer with each other, but what is one of the most memorable beauty experiences you’ve had together?
Kim: Yeah, I mean, I took my first international trip with Allison and her family when I was 16. So, that was really fun for us to go into beauty stores and stuff. And we went to France, and we were all over. One thing that Allison’s always been into is a clear gloss. That’s why it was really important for us to do it. And being younger like that, I was always super into makeup. I was pushing it, trying to do every color shadow you can imagine. But Allison’s constant was always a clear gloss. So, we would always look for lip gloss all over France.
Allison Statter: We would.
Jenn: Is that what you remember, Allison?
Allison: I do.
Jenn: What’s your favorite beauty memory with Kim?
Allison: My beauty memory goes back a little bit earlier. And I think I’ve shared this before, but her dad once took us, me, Kim, and Kourtney, actually, to the Joe Blasco’s salon or store out in Los Angeles when we were young. Like we must’ve been 13, 14, 15-years-old. And I remember him taking us there. And we spent the entire day, and we got our makeup done, and we got to buy all the Joe Blasco makeup. And Kim had already been a big Joe Blasco fan, her and Kourtney both were. So, that’s why we-
Kim: They videotaped it for us.
Allison: Yeah, that’s why we got to go there. Yeah.
Kim: Like a lesson.
Allison: And then we got to come home with all this makeup. And it was like the greatest day of my life. I remember it. I remember having my first Joe Glasgow like the packed foundation. And I remember just being so excited to have it. And it was all because of uncle Robert and Kim.
Jenn: And have you guys done each other’s makeup? Like I know getting ready to go out with my friends, there’s always one person who does everyone’s hair and makeup.
Kim: I don’t know if I really done makeup. I don’t think so. Like everyone had their own style. I know Allison was obsessed with getting her eyebrows done before it was a thing, before people would get our eyebrows done. And so, she’d always go with these like fresh brows. And she was really into eyebrow products, and brow gel, and stuff, like things that I wasn’t really into. Her and her mom are really organized, and they had these like Lucite cases in their bathroom that would either you’d pull out the drawers, and you can organize your makeup in, or it would have these like holes where you put your lipsticks, and your lip glosses. So, we’d sit on her counter. Allison’s house was like the house to go to in high school. And we would sit on the counter.
Kim: I mean, Allison I vividly remember all getting ready together for prom. I did a burgundy shadow with a black dress with burgundy hair, little butterfly, flower thingies. I always had to match my hair clips to my eyeshadow, that was my thing. And we’d sit in Allison’s, in her sink. We’d sit on the counter with our feet in the sink, with our looking in the mirror. And she had this clear organizer thing, and we would just pull her lipsticks. And she had every eyebrow pencil, and every eyebrow gel. So, it was so much fun just like-
Allison: I love that Kim says that I was obsessed with getting my eyebrows done. The reality was that I got like a unibrow at the age of 10, which my son now has, God bless him. And so, I had-
Jess: This was a necessity.
Allison: It was a necessity. Like I had to do the one wax line down the middle or else I had like literally one eyebrow across my face. So, that’s where that eyebrow obsession started to come in. And I still am weirdly obsessed with eyebrows, but I think my recollection is similar to Kim’s. I don’t think that we ever like did a full face on each other, or anything, but we would share products. We would always all get together, and get ready whether we were going to like a school dance, or a party, or prom, or even if we were just going to go hang out, or have friends come over to one of our houses, I feel like we always would just get ready together. And share what products we had, and swap things, and stuff like that.
Jenn: So, if your super power was like you were the brow girl, or at least that’s the reputation you have. What was Kim known for? I guess, matching the clips and the eyeshadow. Anything else?
Kim: I was just obsessed with lipstick. I mean, I remember always loving more brownie tones, and loving like this color from Revlon, and loving just like MAC Spice, and more like these burgundy tones. I was just obsessed with a dark lip.
Jess: Do you remember the color from Revlon?
Kim: I don’t, but I mentioned one time at an interview, me and Nicole Richie stole a lipstick from Thrifty that’s like Rite Aid.
Jess: The drugstore. Yeah.
Kim: Years and years and years ago, like when we were like 10. We didn’t know it was wrong, obviously-
Jess: So, not like 10 years ago?
Kim: No. Not like last year. We were kids, we were like 10. And then I said something, and then Revlon sent me like a huge care package of like 100 lipsticks, and was like, "Now, you don’t have to steal it." Or something.
Jess: Oh, that’s funny. That’s so funny.
Kim: It was really funny. Yeah. My favorite color ever. I have pictures somewhere else. It’s not really in these pictures, but yeah, I was obsessed with lip liners. I would always just have like, not a lot of makeup, but just a lipstick, and a lip liner was always my thing.
Jess: Yeah, I know, I get it. Is there a beauty look, or even a fashion look that the other one wish you would try? I think what’s really nice about your friendship, it seems like you’re very encouraging of each other’s aesthetics. Is there something that you see one the other in?
Allison: I feel like Kim is going to have so many that she would love for me to try. So, I cannot wait to hear her answer to this.
Kim: I would love, love, love Allison— That’s why we did this collab for like busy women on the go, because she’s like doing her makeup in the car half the time. She’s not as patient as me. I would love, love, love ... Our campaign pics, like how gorgeous does she look? I’m obsessed with these photos.
Jess: Beautiful.
Kim: And I would love to see her in a very 90s like matte shadow, cut crease, like a bigger lined, darker outer lip, and then light in the middle, just very 90s. I feel like you never really go that glam.
Allison: Yeah, we should do that. Let’s do it.
Kim: We should. You know what I was thinking just for fun? And tell me, Allison, what the lifers would think, is I thought one day we could say we’re all going to go to lunch. And then, I want to drive to a studio and have glam for all the girls, just so we could do a photo shoot together.
Allison: It would be so fun.
Kim: Just like how you and I did ours.
Allison: It would be so fun. I feel like everyone would look so pretty too with your expertise and consultation on how they should have their hair and makeup, and what they should wear.
Kim: I’ll do it.
Jenn: Are these lifers you’re talking about just like a group of all of you, your friends?
Allison: Yeah.
Kim: It’s a group of seven of us, our best friends since preschool.
Allison: We’ve all grown up together. We’ve been together literally ... I mean, Kim and I have known each other since Kim was in the womb because I’m a little bit older than she is. I mean, I don’t remember my life without Kim in it. I will tell you that. And we’ve had so many different phases of our life-
Kim: Same.
Allison: ... From like just preschool, into elementary school, into high school. Some of us went to college, some of us didn’t. And we’ve all maintained this incredible relationship. And I feel like even in our adult lives, especially, as we’ve all gotten married and had kids, like the connection is stronger than it’s ever been because when you grow up, and you become an adult, like you just need your friends more than ever. I mean, I say to Kim all the time, I’m like, "Honestly, who knew being an adult was going to be this hard?" Like we’re all turning 40 this year. And it’s just been really amazing that we have this group of friends. There’s seven of us, and we have a text thread that we call lifers, and we talk about everything, and anything on it. And we just support each other, like literally about everything. And it’s just really refreshing.
Jenn: And these are not celebrities, right?
Allison: No.
Jenn: These are just like, your-
Kim: No. Yeah, just our best friends.
Allison: Can I just answer the one thing that I would like Kim to try? Although, I will say, I feel like Kim does try everything because she’s such a chameleon. And like she’s constantly ahead of the curve when it comes to trends, both not just in beauty, but in clothes, and just in everything. But we have a constant inside joke about my love for Crocs, and Kim hates them so much. She literally is like, "I can’t. I can’t with your Crocs." And so, I feel like I would just love Kim to wear a pair of Crocs one day, and understand the comfort of the Croc.
Jenn: Kim, will you put your children in a Croc, or like none of the Kardashian Wests are even going to see a Croc-
Allison: Never.
Jenn: ... In their lifetime?
Kim: No, we have Yeezy Foam Runners.
Allison: Those just came out-
Kim: They’re like the-
Allison: Those just came out.
Kim: Yeah. But I’ve-
Allison: Crocs have been around for ages.
Kim: Yeah, I know. I wasn’t into them then, and I won’t be into them anytime soon. I can’t. It’s just-
Allison: I was just wearing my strawberry Crocs, and Chi was like-
Kim: You know what?
Allison: " ... I love strawberries." And I was like, "Do you want me to get you a pair?"
Kim: And I was like, "No, she doesn’t. She’s two. And she definitely doesn’t." But I got Allison for Christmas last year, a few Christmases ago, as a joke, I got her the big Balenciaga platform Crocs, and knowing she’d never wear them ever, but it was just like a joke.
Allison: In bright pink. Well, when Balenciaga came out with the platform Crocs on the runway, I sent it to her, I was like, "Look who’s cool now." And Kim was like, "I still won’t wear them. And I still don’t like them." I’m like, "Okay, I get it."
Jess: Okay. I know, I respect. I understand. They’re definitely a statement. They’re definitely a statement. Okay, Allison, I was really interested in something you said before about how you have your lifers, you were all besties growing up, and now you are all around turning 40, and you guys need each other more than ever. It’s not like the bond has only become stronger as your lives have become more complicated. And you probably have less time for one another. You can’t sit on the counter with your feet in the sink anymore, and like B.S. I really relate to that. I think Jenn probably does too. And I think a lot of our listeners do because it’s like we’re all really busy people. You guys each have your own immense careers, but friendships take work. How are you guys navigating this? The group text is one thing, but I’m really inspired by the fact that you guys are stronger as your lives have gotten more complicated.
Allison: Yeah.
Kim: Well, I think in life, we’ve made that choice to make time for each other. I mean, anything that goes on in life ... I’m really close with Allison’s mom, and her mom is my mom’s best friend, and Allison’s really close with my mom. So, when she’s having a problem, she’ll go to my mom, when I’m having a problem, I’ll go to her mom. So, we’re kind of like beyond besties, it’s like family. And so, I think that just with the other girls, I mean, we make the time. I think it’s also our escape. We all have been with each other through babies. And we’ve used each other’s baby nurses, and shared baby clothes, and hand me downs. We remember what it’s like being in elementary school together, and then high school, and then college. And we have so many memories that I just don’t think we’d let that go.
Jess: Are there any like little tips for our listeners? I love that your line is about friendship. And so much of this is about friendship. Do you have any like great tips about being a great friend, or little things that you do to keep the bond alive when you both are so busy with your own careers and families?
Kim: Well, I was just going to say, you have to make it a priority. You have to understand that we might not see each other all the time, but we really take the time to do those like family dinners, girls dinners, girls trips. Every time it’s someone’s birthday, the girls are so good. We’ll take the time to go to Palm Springs, all of us, or somewhere close, and just have that road trip for two days. And we realized we really need an away as moms, just to get away for a night or two.
Allison: I was going to say too, it’s a unique friendship. And I feel like as we all have these moments in our life, I’ve had so many people, whether it’s my aunt, or another friend that isn’t a lifer, but I love dearly obviously come up to me, and I’m sure Kim has heard this too because her mom has even said it just how lucky we are that we have these friendships, because it’s not common. But to us, it is so common, because we’ve had it for so long. And I think that, especially, with someone like Kim who’s in our inner circle, and who is so busy, her life is so busy, and everyone’s lives are busy, but to see what she juggles, and to see what she does, and then literally still has time to show up for us, whether it’s a dinner or just when she ... because she lives in Hidden Hills, and I still live in the city.
Allison: And so, it’s not as easy for us, but if she’s in the city going to an appointment, she’ll text me, and she’ll say like, "I’m going to an appointment in the city. Are you around? Can I stop by?" Like just those little things that we do for each other I think are so important.
Jess: Outside of your friendship, just when it comes to friendship in general, is there anything where like it’s a no, no for you? Outside of the obvious things like don’t sleep with my boyfriend or don’t steal my business, you know? Like are there any things that are like, a friend-
Jenn: Deal breakers.
Jess: Yeah, deal breakers. Maybe it’s like they always have to be on time, or I don’t know. People have their own things.
Allison: Yeah. Mine is don’t ask me anything personal about Kim.
Jess: I imagine for people in your orbit, that is probably a very big deal breaker. That’s a good test like who’s real and who’s not.
Kim: Allison grew up ... I mean, her dad is like the biggest music manager in the world. So, she grew up around every huge artist, and every ... I just remember so vividly being at her parents’ house and us being like 10-years-old. And I’ve said this story before, but not really in relation to Allison. And this is totally drifting off of the question, but being in her house and The Real World came on, it was like 1989. And we saw The Real World, so we were what? Nine, 10-years-old. And I said to her, like, "That’s it. That’s what I want to do when I grow up. I want to be on a reality show."
Kim: No, I said, "When we’re 18, we’re going to make a video, and let’s see if we can make it." You know? And she was like, "Just make a video. I’ll give it to my dad. I’ll have him send it to someone at MTV." And she goes, "But I don’t want to make a video. I don’t really want to be on camera, I’ll be your manager." And we were like dreaming of this whole fun thing that we wanted to do. And it’s so funny because the producers of that show are the producers of my show. So, it’s like so full circle all these years later.
Jenn: So full circle.
Kim: I don’t know what made me think of that. I think I-
Jess: It was the original one, the New York one?
Kim: Yes.
Jess: That’s so funny.
Kim: Yes, with Puck?
Jess: That was great. That was the best season.
Jenn: You manifested it. Okay. I’m going to take a pause real quick, and then we’re going to talk about product, which is why we’re here.
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[COMMERCIAL BREAK]
[MUSIC]
Jenn: Okay. So, we’re back with Kim and Allison talking about your BFF themed collection. I have to ask, is this the first business thing you’ve done together other than of course manifesting a reality show for Kim?
Kim: It is right? Ish.
Allison: Well, it is. It’s the first thing that we’ve done together that has been public-facing, I would say, because I, as Kim said, always like to be behind the camera, and she’s way more natural in front of the camera than I am. But-
Kim: That’s why she’s never on my show, hardly, because she doesn’t want to be on camera.
Allison: I’ve been on it more and more though. I feel like I’ve been doing better with that.
Kim: You have.
Jenn: Were you trying to get her on the show more? Has this been a thing?
Kim: Well, It’s like funny because it’s her and her mom ... Like that whole life of like my best friends, they don’t love to be on camera. So, I have like my other group of best friends, Lala, Jonathan, who are my best friends also, but their life is more in front of the camera. So, I feel like sometimes I’m like, "Wait, the public doesn’t know about all my lifers, and my real best friend, Allison. They do. If you’re a fan, I think you do know. But she’s very shy, and doesn’t like to be in front of the camera. So, this was like a really big deal that I was able to get her to do this collab with me.
Jenn: And what was the impetus for the collection?
Allison: We’ve been able to create these businesses independently of each other, which I think is really special. Like Kim has built an incredible empire that I’m just in awe of every single day. And her ability to manage it all with such grace is just incredible. I watch her and I am blown away. And I worked for my dad for a very, very, very long time, and started my own company five years ago, Blended Strategy Group. And I was really driven to have something of my own. And Kim was part of that. I saw what she was doing, and everything that she was able to accomplish. And so, I just feel really grateful that we have this friendship where my success doesn’t depend on what she’s built in the Kardashian empire, and vice versa. And we just support each other through it. And this I felt like was finally a time where she has done such an incredible job building KKW Beauty, and she’s literally done multiple different collaborations.
Allison: And so, when we started talking about this, I was like, "We should do a best friend collab." She’s like, "Yeah, let’s do it. You would do that?" And I was like, "Yeah, because I think it would be amazing for women to have makeup that I can relate to, not just the makeup that KKW puts out, and have this very attainable collection that’s beautiful, that women who maybe aren’t as savvy in doing makeup can use, and understand how to use it, and use it quickly." Because like Kim said, I’ve turned into that person who sometimes is putting their mascara on while driving. And I’m like, "I can’t believe I’m that person." I keep a separate makeup bag in my work bag because sometimes I have to do my makeup at my desk. And it’s simple how I do my makeup.
Allison: And so, when we talked about it, I was like, "Can I show you how I put my makeup on?" She’s like, "Yeah." So, I went to her house one day, and I showed her how I did it, and she literally looked at me, she’s like, "That’s how you do that? Oh my God, I would have never thought of that. That’s crazy that you use that product for this or whatever it is." And that really was like the catalyst to doing this. And we’ve been working on it for a really long time, right Kim? I mean, I feel like we’ve been doing this for like over a year.
Kim: Yeah. It’s been a while.
Jess: So, these products are all really speedy. They’re all about like speed, and just getting it on, and for like the busy woman, right?
Kim: Yes.
Jenn: Very cool. I love the outer packaging. It’s like this really fun, collage style packaging of ... It’s a photo collage of you guys throughout the years. Probably from like teenager to you said the most recent photos, you guys at your baby shower, right Kim?
Kim: Yeah. That was the most recent one.
Jenn: Did you sit there and comb through like old shoe boxes of photos? How did you go through this? How did you choose?
Kim: Well, I have everything digitized, so luckily I was able to go through it. I have photo albums. I have everything together. I’m really organized. So-
Allison: Kim thinks I’m organized. You guys should see how organized Kim is. It’s bananas.
Jess: I’m really intimidated when you just said everything is digitized. I’m like, okay?
Kim: Yes. Well, no…There was fires in Calabasas, and like my property literally caught fire. And I literally was like, "What do I grab?" You know? And I grabbed all my photo albums. And so, I was like, "You know what?" I’m not going to live like this. I packed up twice. And then I was like, "I’m going to send everything in a storage facility an hour away, but I want to digitize it. I want to know that I have it and on hard drive." So, it really taught me how to be organized on a whole other level and saved my memories. Because that’s all we have in life, you know?
Jess: Smart. No, very smart. So, I mean, the pictures are adorable. Was there a photo that got vetoed? Was there something that somebody was like, "Absolutely not. No Kim, no Allison."
Allison: I mean, to be honest with you, I trust Kim more than anyone. She’s like the queen of being like, "You look great in this. You should use this picture or not." So, when she was like, "This’ll look great with us." I’m like, "Yeah, great. Go for it." I genuinely trust her more than anyone when it comes to that stuff.
Kim: But I do think at first they showed me a version of like just as many pictures of us older. And then I was like, "You know what? I get not putting in the pictures when we’re like two-years-old and we’re toddlers, because we’re not wearing makeup then, and that doesn’t make sense." But the pictures like to have us still like seven, eight, nine, 10-years-old, and sprinkle some of those in. Just so like the consumer can see our lifelong friendship, and can understand that we’ve been best friends for our whole lives, not just since we’ve been older, and see college picks as our youngest picks. So, we did veto a lot of like younger picks, I’d say.
Allison: Yeah.
Jenn: Can I just ask what’s up with this hat here? The both of you are in overalls, and Kim has on like, a marabou feather something? I’m not sure.
Allison: That was our Europe trip. We went to Europe, and we were in-
Kim: I was 16.
Allison: Yeah, we were in London, and we went to a hat store in London. You know? I mean, because in the UK hats are like a thing, you know? And my mom at the time was like, "This is amazing." And we went into the hat store, and she literally was overwhelmed with how many amazing hats there were. And that was her favorite one. I think we had one with a black feather too. Right Kim?
Kim: Yeah, we did. And she needed to hold them on the airport, and everything back. And I said I’d wear one. And so, these are pictures of us in the airport. And I said, "Sure, I’ll wear it for you, so, you don’t have to hold them."
Jenn: Like a fascinator.
Allison: And we would walk around … We would walk around wearing these hats. Mine was not cute. Mine was like bright pink with these ugly plastic flowers on it. In typical fashion, I got like the ugliest one and Kim got the prettiest one. But that just goes to say-
Kim: Oh, stop.
Allison: ... That just goes to say that like her taste was always so much better than mine because I clearly was drawn to the plastic, pink hat for some reason. But-
Kim: I’m looking at these pictures and I’m seeing so many beauty trends. If you look in this one, I have a red jewel glued onto my face. I was obsessed with like jewels and gluing them on to match my red lips. And then, this other one here, I have turquoise eye shadow. I still have that shadow in my room. It’s a MAC pot.
Jenn: I like it that you did it on the lower lash line-
Jess: Yeah, I think it still works.
Jenn: ...which is ahead of the curve, Kim.
Kim: Yeah, I was obsessed with the lower lash line color.
Allison: She was always ahead of the curve.
Kim: That was my thing.
Allison: She was always ahead of the curve, especially, with makeup and clothes. I remember when she wore her first Mark Wong Nark dress, I was like, "Oh my God, what is that? And where did you get that? And you look amazing in it." It was like she was always ahead of it.
Jenn: And can I ask about these shade names? Because I heard from someone on your team that they’re like inside jokes. And I understand if you don’t want to share all of them, but I’m looking at your eyeshadow palette. And one of them is called pager.
Jess: That one stuck out for me too, that one made me laugh so hard. It was like this is so 90s.
Jenn: It’s this like little matte beige.
Kim: I was obsessed with a pager. I had a lavender pager. I had a navy blue pager. That’s how I communicated.
Allison: Mine was clear, and it would light up. And we would page each other constantly. We would each have a code. So, we didn’t even need to page each other the phone number. Or for example, if like I was home, and I needed to get in touch with Kim, I would just page her my code. And then I would do like dash 143, which was I love you. So, she knew to call me at home. But if I was at a friend’s house, and she didn’t know that phone number, I would put the phone number in with a dash with my code. So, she knew it was me. And then she would call back and ask for me. And I’d be like, "Hi, where are you? Can you come here? What are you doing?"
Allison: And that’s how we all communicated was through these pagers. And we would have like different codes for different things, which we don’t need to share all the codes because some of them were inappropriate, but we were pretty obsessed with our pagers.
Jess: A simpler time.
Allison: It was.
Jenn: It really was a simpler time. There’s a shimmery-gray- lavender, 143. And I was wondering what that was.
Allison: I love you.
Jenn: Now I know. Pager code.
Kim: Yes. That’s pager code for I love you.
Allison: No. Yeah.
Jenn: That’s I love you. That’s really sweet. And I just had to ask about the lip gloss because it was like bringing me back to my early aughts, like Juicy Tube days. You did say that that was Allison’s thing, right? The clear gloss.
Allison: I’m obsessed with clear gloss.
Kim: Yeah, always loved it.
Allison: I have to-
Kim: Has it everywhere she goes.
Allison: ... Everywhere. Might just drink it. I just feel like I hate a dry lip. It’s my pet peeve when I have a dry lip. I’ll be in a meeting and I’ll have a dry lip, and I’ll be like, "Ugh, I can’t believe I have a dry lip. I probably look absurd." And a clear lip, even if there isn’t a cut, like you have it over the crayon, which looks beautiful right now. But if you did either just the crayon, which is really pretty as well without the clear over it. But if you do just a clear, like at least you have something on your lip, and it’s just not a dry lip. Even if it’s clear, it just like gives you a juicy lip. You know what I mean?
Jenn: Everybody on Allison’s team, listen up. No dry lips.
Allison: Yeah.
Jess: No, I get it. I get it. No, it’s just icky. It’s an icky feeling.
Allison: Yeah. I’m like, "Ugh, what do I look like?" And I have small lips. I don’t have big, beautiful, voluptuous lips. So, I need to make sure that I’m keeping them glossy, so that at least they look pretty. And you don’t have to look in the mirror when you put on a clear lap, you could just ... You know?
Jess: Yeah, agree.
Allison: Smother it on there.
Jess: Jenn, should we go to the speed round?
Jenn: Sure. You’re in charge this time Jess.
Jess: So, at the end of every interview, we do a speed round of questions. We’ve never done this with two people, so it should be fun. So, but you each have to answer. It’s like word association. Don’t overthink, it’s the first thing that comes to your mind. Okay?
Allison: Okay. Kim, you go first for each one, and then I’ll go second.
Kim: Okay.
Jess: What’s the first beauty product you ever fell in love with?
Kim: Yeah. I’d say Make Up For Ever, colorful eyeshadow. One of my good friends in high school, her dad owned it, so she would have it all over, and she would just give it to us. That’s how I fell in love with makeup-
Jess: Just like all of those powders?
Kim: Yeah, just powder colors.
Allison: Mine’s the Spice lip liner by MAC.
Jenn: A classic.
Allison: Classic.
Jess: Ultimate.
Allison: Because you could put the Spice lip liner on with the clear gloss, and then color it in a little bit, and you had a beautiful lip.
Jenn: Allison, you’re halfway to that 90s look Kim wants for you.
Allison: I really am.
Jess: She just needs an extra 45 minutes in the morning to do it.
Allison: Yeah, an hour.
Jess: Exactly. Okay. So, we know that you’re both quite well-connected, but who is this either celebrity, a politician, an artist, an athlete, this person could be dead or alive that you know that you would be best friends with?
Allison: Kim Kardashian.
Jess: This is like a dinner party question. Like who would you invite to your dream dinner party? But there’s got to be someone here like I know that we would gel, but like they’re just not in your life yet.
Kim: I mean, I’d love to have dinner with like Marilyn Monroe. It’s more like I don’t know if I’d vibe or be friends with, I’d just love to have a conversation with.
Jess: What would you ask her?
Jenn: What about you Allison?
Jess: Wait, I’ve got to follow up. She’s like a funny one. There’s so much going on there, but is there something about her that you like respond to? Or like what would you want to ask, or you just want to see what’s going on?
Kim: I mean, I would probably ... And sorry, not to pivot- But I would probably actually maybe pick like Jackie O., I love her. I know they’re like the opposite. I would just want to know so much. There’s so much I’d want ... I’d ask Marilyn like, "Come on. Who were you sleeping with? I really want to know, is it JFK? I’d want to know these things. Did you really OD? Did you not? Were you pregnant with… There’s so much I want to know.
Jess: I totally understand and relate to that. Okay. Allison, I’m sorry you have the floor.
Allison: I think honestly it’s a hard one because there are so many people that I just feel like I’d like to have one conversation with, but the one that I think would be most intriguing would probably be Princess Diana.
Jenn: This is like excellent dinner party before
Jess: Yeah, this is really, really good. These are really good.
Allison: Yeah. Me, Kim, Marilyn, and Princess Diana, we would have the best time.
Jess: The people need to know, or at least we all do.
Allison: Yeah. I just-
Jess: There’s a lot to ask, yeah.
Allison: I just feel like I would want to know so many things about that. That feels like there’s so many ... And she feels like she was such a good person, like just such a genuinely good person. And as a fellow mom of boys, I would just have so many things to talk to her about.
Jess: I love that. I love your answers. Okay. This one’s much more straightforward. What is your favorite indulgent snack?
Kim: Cookies and cream ice cream.
Jess: Brand?
Kim: No particular brand, but Häagen-Dazs is the best brand, or See’s Candies molasses chips—milk chocolate molasses chips.
Allison: The best.
Jenn: I don’t know this.
Kim: What?
Allison: The best!
Jenn: I’ll check it out.
Kim: I’m going to go eat one right after this.
Allison: They’re so good.
Jess: Allison, what about you?
Allison: I would say any flavor of ice cream minus strawberry, to be honest, I just love ice cream.
Jenn: [Crosstalk] Strawberry would go with your Crocs.
Allison: I know my Crocs and ice cream. My brother has learned how to make ice cream in quarantine, and has made Kim and I both ice cream. And it is so good. He made us S’mores Ice Cream the other night and it was delicious. He made you cookies and cream, right Kim?
Kim: He made me a cookies and cream and an Oreo mint.
Jess: Mmm. That sounds real good. Okay. What is the song that pumps you up? Like your get ready song?
Kim: I don’t know. I like soft music. I don’t know. Allison, what would we listen to? I feel like we would blast music so loud getting ready.
Allison: Yeah, we would blast-
Kim: Yeah.
Allison: ... A lot of SWV. We would blast a lot of Martika. We would do-
Jenn: Toy Soldier?
Kim: I really love that song.
Allison: Yeah.
Kim: Toy Soldier.
Allison: Toy Soldier. We would do like dance routines to Toy Soldier all the time.
Kim: Fun fact, mine and Allison’s song is “Cherish” by Madonna. And her parents had a beach house in Malibu, we were young.
Jess: I know where this is going.
Kim: We hear the music outside, Herb Ritts shooting Madonna Cherish video on the beach in Malibu.
Allison: On the beach.
Kim: And Allison and I got to sit on the beach and watch it. And I told Madonna this story when I first met her. And it was so amazing. Like-
Jess: Was she amused?
Kim: She loved the story, but I think what she said was, "Oh, I thought we had like kicked everyone off the beach or something. And it was like this private experience." And I was like, "We saw it. And we loved it. And it will forever be in my brain. And one of the best memories ever." I mean, who gets to witness that, you know?
Jess: That is so cool. That was such a beautiful video. It was so uplifting. It’s such a different video for ... I mean, just all of her videos are very different from one another. But I don’t know. That’s an awesome memory.
Jenn: This also explains the name of this highlighter in this palette.
Jess: Cherish? Is it Cherish?
Kim: Yeah.
Jess: That is a beautiful memory.
Jenn: Yeah.
Jess: And then last, last question. What do you want to raise a wand to? And that is our Fat Mascara term for what do you want to give a shout out to? What are you obsessed with right now? It could be a product, could be a TV show, could be anything.
Jenn: A movement.
Allison: I have to go first for this one. I’m going to raise my wand to Kim. Because I feel like people don’t realize how much this woman does.
Kim: Oh, Al-
Allison: Like when you put it into perspective, and you take the fame out of it, and when you look at it from a human standpoint, which is how I always look at her, you know what I mean? And you see it from, she’s a wife, she has four kids. She has multiple businesses. She’s a daughter, she’s a granddaughter, she’s a friend. She’s a sister.
Kim: She’s In law school.
Allison: She’s in… She’s becoming a lawyer. When you look at it from that lens, as opposed to the fact that she has this incredible following on social media, or she’s one of the most famous people in the world, like all of those things, and you just put it in a human perspective, and how much she does, and what an incredible person she is, I mean, I’m just so lucky that I get to call her my best friend. So, that’s my wand.
Kim: Aw, I love you.
Jess: That’s very sweet.
Kim: I love you so much.
Allison: I love you. I love you. I’m so proud of you.
Kim: Thank you. I love you. I’m so proud of you.
Allison: Thanks doll.
Kim: I would say… I’m going to raise my wand to anyone fighting a fight that they really believe in. Like, for me, whether it’s like justice reform, or people that are fighting to save people’s lives that really deserve that second chance at life. I really support, and respect, and it’s not easy. And also just to busy working moms. It’s so hard. And I know sometimes we make it look easy, but it’s not. And the message sometimes gets lost when everyone’s posting. And I’m guilty myself, you post so many of the amazing things on your social media but it’s hard. It’s so hard raising kids, and working, and especially in the time that we’re in now. So, any moms, wand raised to you.
Allison: We should also raise wands to teachers. I feel like a lot of people can use wands right now. I mean, what I see my children’s teachers going through, trying to teach these children remotely, one of my youngest son is going into kindergarten, and literally, we just did two days of what they’re calling like the kindergarten camp, which they usually do in real life, in the school where the kids become acclimated to the classroom, and the campus. And they have to do it through a computer, and get these five and six-year-olds to sit focused, draw pictures, read a book, all these things.
Allison: I’m literally like in awe of these teachers. They already I feel like are underpaid, and then this, they’re putting in so much more work. And it’s just, I’m so grateful to them, and to the administrators at the school who have to like figure this out too.
Jess: I love that.
Jenn: Excellent “Raise A Wands.”
Jess: Yeah, thank you so ... Yeah. Thank you so much for acknowledging all of the people, and the movements that you’ve just done. So, thank you.
Jenn: Yeah, and thanks for coming on the show guys.
Jess: Yeah, and congrats.
Allison: Of course. Thank you for having us.
Kim: Thanks for having us.
Allison: I hope you guys love the collection as much as we do.
Jenn: We do.
Allison: It’s a labor of love. And I’m really just so grateful to Kim that she allowed for me to be part of her incredible business, and be able to get this into the hands of so many women and men for that matter. And I hope everyone loves it.
[MUSICAL BREAK]
Jess: I mean.
Jenn: I mean, is everybody else breathing a big sigh of relief that we actually got that interview recorded, and it sounded okay? Because that’s what we’re doing right now.
Jess: The whole time I was just nervous like don’t crash. It did crash a couple of times in the middle, but it’s fine.
Jenn: It was fine. We got it done. Also, I was like, I would go have a margarita with these ladies, and talk about business, and you’d talk about being a mom. And they care about the important stuff. They’re worried about their kids in school. Like it was weirdly normal. No?
Jess: I know. I liked that it got a bit loftier at the end. I did want to talk about Marilyn Monroe, and especially, Princess Diana a little bit more. I have my own theories. But-
Jenn: I thought that was so interesting. They both clearly wanted answers. They’re curious. They’re like they picked women who have like mystery about them.
Jess: Mystery and that like they’re the most photographed women in the world. Diana was, and Marilyn, and Jackie.
Jenn: In my head, I was just like, "Kim, you’re the modern day version of that person." So, it was like an interesting parallel for me. Anyway, I think the collection is actually really nice because I’m wearing one of the lip crayons, and I wore it during the interview. I really, really like it. It’s all so wearable, and like Allison was saying, it’s like slap it on one, two, three, not slap it on, delicately apply it. You know the drill. Beautiful. Well done girls.
Jess: No, I’m interested in the slap on. It is really nice.
Jenn: Not girls, women. Well done women.
Jess: All right, listen-
Jenn: Shall we raise a wand ourselves?
Jess: Yeah, let’s talk about Raise A Wand. On the slap-on tip, I am really into eyeliners right now because I really want to just pop a little bit. I feel like-
Jenn: Above the mask.
Jess: Above the mask. And also it’s like I remember a media coach telling me once that the camera sucks energy. Because I guess she thought I was like ... I need this to be a little bit more like zippy-
Jenn: I’ve been told that many times by a media coach. Like you have to smile even when the camera’s not on, and like fake enthusiasm. And you think it feels so fake, and then you watch the thing, and you actually look quite normal.
Jess: Yeah. I was like, "I look like I’m insane right now. I can’t feign that much enthusiasm." She’s like, "You seem a little too relaxed and cool." And then I watched, I was like, "Yeah, I look like I’m a dud."
Jenn: Miserable.
Jess: Exactly. So, I think with Zoom, it’s like the screen steals your makeup.
Jenn: Absolute fury.
Jess: It sucks the energy and it sucks the makeup. So, I’m trying to pop it without looking like bozo. And one of the liners that I’m really relying on because it doesn’t look bozo, but it gives you a really interesting, kind of dramatic without being like, "Oh, like what’s going on with this lady today?" Marc Jacobs fine liner in Dove Affair. Now, I look this up, and I have some exciting news for you. Boy, I really hope you’re listening to this. I hope this is existing.
Jess: I hope the sale is still going on when this goes live, because recording about weekend events. Dove Affair, which is a beautiful, gray lilac is only $12 right now from 25. Okay? On marcjacobsbeauty.com. Only $12. That is like almost a drugstore price. I love this one.
Jenn: Yeah, I got to go check if that mascara I love is on sale from them too. Okay. Go on.
Jess: It’s so good. It’s so good. So, you put the Dove Affair on. It’s a smoky lilac. You know that I’m into a lilac right now. It has no shimmer. It’s so skinny. It’s such a skinny liner. It’s a twist up. Boom, boom, boom, put it right on your lash line. And then, I actually like to smoke it out really quickly with my finger. So, like Allison’s saying, we are busy ladies, we’ve got to be on the go. I’m doing this literary. It says like, "Your Zoom call starts at 10:30 in the morning, at 10:27, I’m doing a full eye look. 10:30, bam.
Jenn: With your little Marc Jacobs Dove Affair.
Jess: Yeah. It’s such a beautiful color. And it’s a color that I never see from any other brands.
Jenn: I wonder how that would look on like my medium oliveness, like gray. Because it looks very pretty on you.
Jess: Thank you.
Jenn: I should try that.
Jess: Try it. And it’s on sale. So, it’s not the end of the world if it doesn’t work.
Jenn: I like that it doesn’t look skinny because I noticed my lids have a lot of texture now, and they’re heavier than they used to be. So, I have to lift them up to get the liner on. And so, a skinny pencil tip would be much better for a more mature eye.
Jess: That’s a good point. That’s a good point. And it’s smudgy too, which is really nice.
Jenn: Okay. This is random. I still haven’t gotten my hair cut this year. And I don’t know. I just feel a little bit weird about like ... I’m not desperate for a haircut, so I don’t want to ... I probably should go in because they want my money, but I’ve been trying to stay away. Like my friends with the great bob, my pixie cut friends, they need the haircuts more than me. So, I actually just trimmed ... Jon [Reyman], don’t freak out. That’s my hair stylist over at Spoke & Weal. Because last time I cut my hair, he was like I’m not fixing that again. But I have these Fromm shears, F-R-O-M-M. They were like 30 bucks on Amazon. I’m telling you the thing that goes wrong ... Last time I cut my hair was I did not use haircutting shears.
Jenn: And he explained that that explodes the tip of the hair and you get more split ends. You need a very sharp pair of haircutting shears. And I did this trick I learned online. I don’t actually know if this works, but you twist your ponytail into a twist. And then the split ends that fry out, you know [crosstalk 00:48:24] you trim those off only. And so, then I trim those off of the little twisted ponytail. And then at the very, very end, I did like a two millimeter trim. Sorry. Our sound editor is going to get mad because I was moving away from the mic to demonstrate for you, with the Fromm shears.
Jenn: It’s like a quickie haircut. This is just to get you by. The key people, is the sharp, sharp scissors. And this is a good pair for 30 bucks, and they’re not sold out on Amazon like every other freaking haircutting product was earlier this spring. So, raise a wand.
Jess: That’s a great tip. That’s a great tip.
Jenn: Well, we’re a beauty podcast, and we do have tips. Yeah. Kim, Allison, thanks for coming on the show. Guys, thanks for listening
Jess: Thank you.
Jenn: See you next week.
[OUTRO MUSIC]
Jenn & Jess: We hope you enjoyed the show. It’s your reviews and feedback that help us make the podcast even better. Head over to iTunes to rate, and review us, or email your thoughts to info@fatmascara.com. We also want to answer your beauty questions, and hear what products you love. To share raise a wand product review, or to ask a beauty question, email us at info@fatmascara. If you send it as a voice memo file, we can even share your voice on the podcast. You can also do that by leaving us a voice message. Our phone number in the United States is (646) 481-8182. Thanks so much for listening.